User:ZyMOS/comments

this is just minor things, i dont have a strong opinion about. Mostly i stay uniform with you. I you could comment each it would help me out.

quick questions

 * Should we use Howto or HowTo? I think we should always use the same for everything wat ever we decide
 * Maybe "How to"? Anyway there will be people who don't like to press Shift button a lot, so maybe the first case. Rules have to be easier to follow for all the people.
 * I really think we should keep it one word. It helps on search engines, also howto as one word has become a standard word for 'how to' or 'tutorial'. i use it when i search for howto's. But i agree with lower case, ill convert my pages that use the old 'HowTo'ZyMOS 23:40, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Should we start by make howtos or should we work on some policy pages?
 * I think we should write one advanced howto. Inyuki 11:42, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Sounds good. any ideas.ZyMOS 23:40, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Should we link words to wikipedia or objects like in this page i linked to wikipedia Howto_install_Gentoo_emerge_on_a_nonGentoo_Distribution_of_Linux
 * As not always will there be the things in Wikipedia. So as long as there is no article identifying the thing on Wikipedia, we should just link to the exact thing on the net. Later the linking to the the things in Wikipedia would be replaced. Inyuki 11:42, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
 * I think its safe to bet that wikipedia has something close, but sometimes as a slightly different name. Linking to the outside would will lead to lots of dead links, as is the case with many of the 'external links' on wikipedia.ZyMOS 23:40, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
 * But Wikipedia is not always open to write articles on anything small and exact. It won't write an article on a piece of code that I found on the net, and I want to explain how it works. Because Wikipedia is oriented to defining more abstract objects.   To prevent the dead links, we can do nothing, but define the object by its name, and giving keywords, using which one could later find it. Finally, if it is a code-object (information object), we could import some of the objects inside of here. But to preserve the internet's content is not in the scope of the project. That'ts the internet archive's function. Inyuki 07:53, 9 February 2006 (UTC)
 * I think we should link to internal objects. Then the internal objects will have a link to wikipedia. Because people want to find other howtos, only if they realy want to see the page on wikipedia they will folow the link from the object page. But then i think we can combine both internal links and external links. If you want to write a short introduction you can use wikipedia links, but for writing the body of the howto i think internals links are better.moa3333 18:49, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
 * I like that idea, the only question is, Should we create the object with the link even if we have no specific howtos for it? ZyMOS 23:40, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
 * well, it will be a stub object; so we don't have to unless there are hostos and/or related objects. Related objects will alow the user to browse more easily when he does not know well the object that s related to his problem. moa3333 18:10, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
 * I think we should link, almost INDEX the real world objects that could ever be used - both abstract and concrete. But maybe that should be something of the mission to another project like Wikipedia, but more informal. Maybe Wiki ID, which I added as a suggestion to proposed Wikimedia projects. Inyuki 07:53, 9 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Should we have a credits section on the howtos.. im not sure
 * I am not sure on this too. Maybe, it would be good that history wouldn't be deleted, so we wouldn't need to worry about this. Inyuki 11:42, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
 * one thought i have is if we use a howto which has a license that requires Attribution, like http://creativecommons.org/characteristic/by?lang=en-us

more in depth
i created templates  and  How does that sound?
 * I see where you are coming from with the more free style howtos, epecially short ones. I think what we should do is have a sugessed format/style, and we should encourage them use it but with no requirements.  However when talking about creating howtos we should not say 'the howto can be freestyle'  we should say 'its recomended that howto follow the standard style'  On short "stubs" the howtos can start out with only a few lines, but a stub notice will be placed. Short but standard example Howto_untar_a_tar_file_or_gzip-bz2_tar_file. Short stub example Howto_Set_the_computers_clock_in_unix
 * I think should be better replaced by just , because it's shorter, and because all this project is about howtos, so the most general stub is a howto stub (we don't say  in Wikipedia, it's just  , and everybody knows that it's an article stub. The other stub types could be made made longer, just like  . Inyuki 02:33, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
 * sounds good ZyMOS 17:32, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
 * I was thinking last night and a think make temporary pages to list all the objects created. one page for each of the page types. This would be a temporary solution until we get more interlinking between the various pages.  There would be no organizing, sorting or catagorize of any sort to prevent catagories from slowly emerging.  They would just be simple lists.  I thing this would make it easyer for use to see what is being done, and help people to see wat is avalable on the site.  We could have the four links on the main page.  Object list Portal List HowTo list Guide list

.... more later perhaps
 * Imporatant: I really think we should NOT make place holders for pages. I thought that it was a mistake to do it on the original page. If we plan to make the page we can make a link, but not the page.  It will remain red, so that way everyone will know that the page need to be created. and anyone can finish it.
 * I didn't get what you actually want to say. What do you mean by place holders? Namespaces? Inyuki 02:33, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
 * By this i ment, if we have an object with 5 howtos example User:ZyMOS/Object:Cow. If we dont have teh howtos done we should not make the howto page.  for example User:ZyMOS/Howto make a cow and from the old site, pages like these, Customize_my_terminal_%28How_can_I%29, Creating_Heavy_water_with_electrolysis_and_distillation.  We should only link howtos that are completed.  The exception to this rule may be objects.  Should we creat objects with no howtos????
 * Yes, I think we should create Object pages without any howtos at all, as well as we should allow the creation of incomplete howtos too. Howtos are subject to improvement and change. And also, the stubs are the beginnings of most of the articles in Wikipedia. Why not to allow the stubs? Inyuki 08:37, 9 February 2006 (UTC)
 * should we start to copy howto's from other gnu fdl conpatable sites. I dont think we should for wikibooks howto bookshelf, until we are a semi-offical project.  but there are a number of other sites... I am torn on this issus.  It would improve the site, but it would fork and howto and one would update and the other would not.  Here are some posible sources
 * http://wiki.linuxquestions.org/wiki/Main_Page : linux
 * http://wiki.ehow.com/Main-Page :Everything
 * http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki/HowTo :emacs
 * http://www.howtoforge.com/ :linux and programing
 * http://www.zensur.freerk.com/ :Bypassing forms of censorship
 * http://www.hoboes.com/html/NetLife/Tutorials.shtml :webprograming
 * http://openwetware.org/wiki/Tutorials : biostuff
 * http://www.developersdigest.org/wiki/index.php/Main_Page : programing
 * http://www.abisource.com/help/en-US/howto/index.html : Abiword
 * an infinate more
 * I think we should, but we should do it not in a machine-like copying style, but choose the best howtos we can find, which had really working procedural knowledge, and enough complexity that we could write them not in one howto, but in a system of howtos, where one howtos are reused in another howtos, and then not just copy, but convert that howto to the procedural format. If think we should now concentrate more on the quality than quantity. (That's also an idea about creating one advanced howto, that I mentioned before). We could start massively copying howtos later, as we will better know how the howtos finally should look like.


 * sounds good to me ZyMOS 17:32, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
 * By the way, I don't know if it is good to have a tree-like structure of procedures. Maybe it's better to encapsule them into links. For general people will not be able to follow tree-like structures, and it looks a task much easier when you have only few steps, rather than a whole expanded tree. For computers it's okay, but not for peope. For people everything must be made simple. Inyuki 02:33, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
 * can you show me an example of what you mean??? ZyMOS 17:32, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Okay. For that needs a complex howto. What about the Howto install Gentoo emerge on a nonGentoo Distribution of Linux? If you should put it into Milestones, what Milestones you would create? (When I say a Milestone, I mean a group of actions, that can be done in an independent sequence, and that moves the system to a desirable state, from which the next group actions (milestone) can be done.). Inyuki 08:10, 9 February 2006 (UTC)